Order of Business - 5th June 2008

Order of Business - 5th June 2008

Senator David Norris: This is the last day we will have an opportunity to discuss the Lisbon
treaty. For this reason the debate we will have this morning is important. This is the first time
I have committed myself against the treaty. It is important that I am allowed to state this. The
people taking a conscientious position on the “No” side have been abused, misrepresented and
treated with a fair amount of contempt. A good number of threats have been made against the
people exercising their democratic right.
Senator Joe O’Toole: No, there have not.
Senator David Norris: Yes, there have, including by the President of the European Commission,
Mr. Barroso, who stated we would pay for it. I wish to ask a couple of questions.
An Cathaoirleach: I hope the Senator is not suggesting that wrong words were used in this
House about people opposing the Lisbon treaty.
Senator David Norris: It depends. I am not that sensitive. However, being called a flake is
not a compliment. I am not getting all dithery about it. One can call me a flake if one wants. I
may be a “loo-la” but I will ask questions that the Government side, and in particular the
Leader, does not like answering.
Senator Ro´ na´n Mullen: The Cathaoirleach himself asked that the word be withdrawn.
Senator David Norris: We have known for sometime that the Taoiseach, Deputy Brian
Cowen, has not fully read the treaty. We then discovered the Commissioner has not fully read
the treaty and stated that anybody who did would be an idiot. This was glossed over by stating,
as I pointed out previously, that Members of the Da´ il voted for the treaty not having read
it. The Minister for Finance has read it, however, and this is what allows him to commend
the treaty.
It has got worse and this is why I want to ask these questions. We now know a member of
the Referendum Commission, Mr. Justice Iarfhlaith O’Neill, does not understand it either. He
was asked about neutrality and after some hesitation he stated that action must be consistent
with Ireland’s policy of neutrality. He then went into the question of moving from unanimity
to qualified majority voting and he stated, “It’s quite difficult to be precise about what that
means. There certainly is not a precision about it whereby we could say it applies to A, B, C
or D.” I make this point as a preface to asking these questions again. We have a Taoiseach
and Commissioner who have not read it and a member of the Referendum Commission who
does not understand it. However, the Irish people are expected to vote for it.
We have expanded the Petersberg tasks to include permission to intervene in the war against
terror in third countries. This is very worrying. Can we have answers on this? Can we have
answers to the questions I asked about the European armaments group, coyly renamed the
European Defence Agency, and whether Ireland will be committed to budgetary spending to
get into the international arms trade which is the specified intention of the European Defence
Agency to go into competition with the United States of America? The Irish people are fully
entitled to know this.
I applaud my colleague Senator Bacik for taking her position but I will state this. It will not
only be men who are involved in these military adventures. Women will also be involved. Many
women in this country will not want us to go down this road. With regard to neutrality——
An Cathaoirleach: Senator Norris has made his point.
Senator David Norris: Fianna Fa´ il never had a principled position on neutrality and de Valera
was pragmatic when he adopted it. Fine Gael would walk us into NATO if it could and it is
perfectly open about it. The problem is that the Irish people——
An Cathaoirleach: This is not relevant to the Order of Business.
Senator David Norris: ——have a principled commitment to neutrality and this is the problem
that politicians have. They want to get around the Irish people but they will not.